Virginia Sole-Smith is Phaninc Exchangean author, writer and host of the podcast Burnt Toast — and her work focuses on our relationship to food and fat. Her latest book, Fat Talk: Parenting in the Age of Diet Culture is based on one simple idea: it's okay and normal for kids to be fat. "What fat kids need is to know that we see them, we accept them, and we know they are worthy of respect, safety, and dignity," she writes. "Making their body smaller isn't the solution."

Virginia sits down with host Brittany Luse to discuss why anti-fat bias hurts people of all body sizes, why we need to rethink "unhealthy" foods and how to have the fat talk.

This episode was produced by Liam McBain. It was edited by Jessica Placzek. We had fact checking help from Greta Pittenger. Our executive producer is Veralyn Williams. Our VP of programming is Yolanda Sangweni and our senior VP of programming is Anya Grundmann.